Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

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Mark Smith
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Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Mark Smith » Tue Mar 18, 2008 5:06 pm

This is an e-mail image I recieved from Jeff Rapps at Tangled Up In Cichlids of an undescribed cichlid from Equador, likely from the western coastal area of the country? Not sure if the photo will post though. Any comments (if the image shows up, that is)
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Bas Pels
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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Bas Pels » Wed Mar 19, 2008 1:32 am

beautiful fish

wow - 30 cm of redness

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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Rick Thibert » Wed Mar 19, 2008 2:15 am

Looks very much like a festae relative!! ?? The spotting being exagerated!

BC

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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Ribstick » Wed Mar 19, 2008 3:23 am

Wow fabulous! :shock:

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Willem Heijns
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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Willem Heijns » Wed Mar 19, 2008 4:08 am

something like this?
festae-13.jpg
I would say this is a (beautiful) veriety of 'Heros' festae.
Slàinte mhath!

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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Mark Smith » Wed Mar 19, 2008 7:44 am

Seems very similar to festae, particularly the one in your excellent photo Willem.

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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Ken Davis » Wed Mar 19, 2008 8:06 am

Except it has no tail spot, which a festae would. Looks like it could be a red type of Caquetaia. Could be a new species or subspecies, I've seen ummbies with lots of red and the spotting sure looks like an ummbie. Maybe the southern limit of their range? Hope Jeff gets some in and we can see a better picture. Ken
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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Bas Pels » Wed Mar 19, 2008 8:45 am

As the present fish does not show anbny sign of a barred pattern (Willems fish ahows withdrawn barrs, but thay are still around) and the tail dot is absent, the fish will, most likely, not be a festae

It could perhaps be a relative, atromalulatum or ornatum, but I don't remember ever seeing good pics of these.

However umbriferum might come closer, but has this fish/group ever been reported from Ecuador? On the other hand, how many information regarding fishes in ecuador is available?

Heroina isonycterina, 'Cichlasoma' festae and 'C' ornatum are the only cichlids from the Heronii tribe listed in Fishbase - and it is hard to believe this is correct.

Thus, please, Jeff, take as many species along as possible

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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Florent » Wed Mar 19, 2008 12:43 pm

Ken Davis wrote:Except it has no tail spot, which a festae would. Looks like it could be a red type of Caquetaia. Could be a new species or subspecies, I've seen ummbies with lots of red and the spotting sure looks like an ummbie. Maybe the southern limit of their range? Hope Jeff gets some in and we can see a better picture. Ken
Just like festae, umbriferum also nomaly have tail spot, "H". ornatus too but the picture show probably a dominant adult. Maybe the coloration isn't charasteristic of the species. I would say more similar to "Heros". ornatum than festae because of spotted cheek

Image

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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Mark Smith » Wed Mar 19, 2008 10:05 pm

Florent

Thanks for including Seiichi's excellent photo. Are you confident that Seiichi's photo is "C". ornatum? Either way, it does show a close relationship to the "undescribed", or unknown, cichlid from Equador.

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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Rico Morgenstern » Thu Mar 20, 2008 11:03 am

What a beauty! Judging from the notes and figures in Stawikowski & Werner ("Die Buntbarsche Amerikas" Vol. 1, 1998), I would guess it is an adult male ‘Cichlasoma’ ornatum rather then any other species considered here. ‘C.’ festae and ‘C.’ atromaculatum are related species, and there is a fourth, namely ‘C.’ gephyrum Eigenmann, 1920, which was orginally described as a subspecies of ornatum. With some reservation, I would find there are certain similarities between the description and figuere of that latter species and the fish photographed by Seiichi Hamada, especially in the black markings, but there is certainly not enough known about this species.

Best regards!
Rico

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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Alex Odesit » Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:13 pm

Beautiful fish, definitely not Festae as many mention already above.
Festae male wont have iridescent dots on it gills, but rather yellow/gold hue

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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Florent » Thu Mar 20, 2008 2:38 pm

Mark Smith wrote:Florent

Thanks for including Seiichi's excellent photo. Are you confident that Seiichi's photo is "C". ornatum? Either way, it does show a close relationship to the "undescribed", or unknown, cichlid from Equador.
You can see other pictures here

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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Mark Smith » Thu Mar 20, 2008 6:09 pm

Thanks everyone for the informative contributions! Hopefully, this species will find its way into the hobby someday soon.

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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Heiko Bleher » Tue Apr 15, 2008 2:43 pm

Dear all,

this is Heiko Bleher and I just saw this nice photo. I collected the same fish recently in Ecuador (Westcoast), but considered it to be a festae variant (which could be or not).

But on the Eastern slope in the very southeast, Shura territory at found not only beautiful A. rivulatus but a complet new dwarf cichlid at 14500 meters (might be grouped inmto Bujurquina, but is no more than a small Apistogramma-size, max 5.5 cm). I had send it to Sven Kullandr and hope he will describe it. We breed quite a few in Germany. Maybe soon I ave time to place some photos, but now I most fly off the lectures in Japan and hopefully see the following weekend I see W. Heijns (did you read my book already?) in helsinki, were we hold lectures together...

Yes I found also several new characoids in Ecuador, there are still several uncollected areas.

All the best to all,

Heiko
www.aquapress-bleher.com
Heiko Bleher

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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Paulo José Alves » Mon Apr 21, 2008 9:10 am

Dear Heiko

If you have time to see this, the new dwarf cichlid you captured in Ecuador was it at 1450 meters high? And the south eastern slope you mention was in the Andes in the Atlantic (Amazonian) drainage or in the Pacific one as it seems it was?
All The Best
Paulo José

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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Tony Idone » Wed May 07, 2008 6:12 pm

I would like to see that fish in a tank,beautiful though

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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Norcal_Cichlid » Sat Nov 28, 2009 10:43 pm

What ever became of the fish in question?
Current stock-2 F1 Breeding pairs of Chuco Micropthalmus, F1 Theraps Lentiginosum (2 breeding pairs), Theraps Coeruleus (1 breeding pair), 7 5-8" F0 Ornatum "Rio Choco", 2 Beani "White" and about 400 Micropthalmus fry!

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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Rico Morgenstern » Sun Nov 29, 2009 3:09 am

Norcal_Cichlid wrote:What ever became of the fish in question?
I am convinced it is an adult male of 'C.' ornatum...

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Re: Undescribed Equadorian cichlid?

Post by Norcal_Cichlid » Fri Dec 04, 2009 7:21 pm

What did Rapps think it is?
Current stock-2 F1 Breeding pairs of Chuco Micropthalmus, F1 Theraps Lentiginosum (2 breeding pairs), Theraps Coeruleus (1 breeding pair), 7 5-8" F0 Ornatum "Rio Choco", 2 Beani "White" and about 400 Micropthalmus fry!

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