T. Asfraci breeding help

Discussion about cichlids from Central America
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Norcal_Cichlid
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Joined: Wed Feb 11, 2004 10:51 pm

T. Asfraci breeding help

Post by Norcal_Cichlid » Wed Sep 22, 2010 8:51 am

Hi all,

As many of you know I have a breeding pair of Asfraci. They spawned once about a year ago and I am not having much luck getting them beyond pre-spawn currently. They share a 180g with a pair of Theraps Coeruleus and 3 tinfoil barbs. I do at least one 50% water change weekly, sometimes more if I up the food intake. I've made sure they are the dominant fish in there and they eat NLS like oscars. I've also been feeding them frozen shrimp the past couple of days in hopes that would trigger something. Water temp is around 80 right now and I do play around with the temp to see if that helps. So far nothing. There are plenty of open, flat spaces as well as many 'caves' for the female to hide when the male gets a little to frisky. It may be that they are just to small still, male is about 9", female around 7". The tank is heavily filtered and has a large powerhead as well to give it a pretty good current. I know the water here is pretty hard and the PH is around 7.5. Any advice? Anyone else in the US have these?
Current stock-2 F1 Breeding pairs of Chuco Micropthalmus, F1 Theraps Lentiginosum (2 breeding pairs), Theraps Coeruleus (1 breeding pair), 7 5-8" F0 Ornatum "Rio Choco", 2 Beani "White" and about 400 Micropthalmus fry!

Dan Woodland
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Re: T. Asfraci breeding help

Post by Dan Woodland » Wed Sep 22, 2010 9:05 am

I bred T. asfraci several times at 76 degrees.

I added a breeding pair of Cryptoheros cutteri. I've often used other small easily bred Cichlids to "nudge" my target fish into breeding. Cryptoheros nanaluteus - these occur with T. asfraci in Panama - is another choice and easily available. I surmise the hormonal shift in the tank from the breeding fish helps influence the fish I'm wanting/needing to breed.

Also, they may be trying to breed but the other fish in the tank prevent them by harassing them when you are not looking. They may not show any damage but that still doesn't mean they aren't being bothered.

Hope this helps.

Norcal_Cichlid
Posts: 278
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Re: T. Asfraci breeding help

Post by Norcal_Cichlid » Wed Sep 22, 2010 2:12 pm

Thanks Dan.

I tried a breeding pair of regular convicts and that didn't work but I must say I had forgotten how rough cons can be! Maybe something mellower like nanoletus would work better.

I kept the pair of Coeruleus in there as they are pretty mellow fish and I was hoping they would spawn as well and trigger the Asfraci but that hasn't happened. Do you think the Coeruleus are too much? To my eyes they aren't aggressive at all, in fact the Asfraci chases them when they get in the way.

What kind of water change regimen were you using? They are incredibly beautiful fish but the spawning thing is starting to annoy me!
Current stock-2 F1 Breeding pairs of Chuco Micropthalmus, F1 Theraps Lentiginosum (2 breeding pairs), Theraps Coeruleus (1 breeding pair), 7 5-8" F0 Ornatum "Rio Choco", 2 Beani "White" and about 400 Micropthalmus fry!

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Grummie2
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Location: England

Re: T. Asfraci breeding help

Post by Grummie2 » Wed Sep 22, 2010 3:37 pm

It may be seasonal, mine haven't shown signs of breeding for 3 or 4 months, whereas earlier in the year they were always at it. I just have a male rotkeil sev in with them, powerhead, slate and tubes. temp 78 ish with natural daylight + a few hours tube lit. I don't go mad on the water changes, usual weekly 25% (pH 7.6, kH 5, gH 9). Getting viable eggs is another matter.......
Graham

Dan Woodland
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Re: T. Asfraci breeding help

Post by Dan Woodland » Wed Sep 22, 2010 3:43 pm

Norcal_Cichlid wrote:Thanks Dan.

I tried a breeding pair of regular convicts and that didn't work but I must say I had forgotten how rough cons can be! Maybe something mellower like nanoletus would work better.

I kept the pair of Coeruleus in there as they are pretty mellow fish and I was hoping they would spawn as well and trigger the Asfraci but that hasn't happened. Do you think the Coeruleus are too much? To my eyes they aren't aggressive at all, in fact the Asfraci chases them when they get in the way.

What kind of water change regimen were you using? They are incredibly beautiful fish but the spawning thing is starting to annoy me!
My automated system changes water twice daily. A 180 would get about 10-12 gallons per day, 5-6 at 9 pm and again at 2 am. I may even bump that up to 14 gallons for a 180. I just added four 180 gallon tanks to my room. The fish must love it because the beani and splendida have already bred - they both loaded rocks full of eggs!! Hopefully my F. rostratus and H. labridens aren't far behind! :D All tanks are maintained at 76 degrees and the water added from the water change system is set to 80 degrees.

In my opinion if they are chasing them they are not breeding.

T. asfraci come from very rapid cool water streams - the temperature can fluctuate from 70 to mid 80s. I now use water circulating pumps in all my tanks - the fish love it and it seems to make them act more like they do in the wild.

Norcal_Cichlid
Posts: 278
Joined: Wed Feb 11, 2004 10:51 pm

Re: T. Asfraci breeding help

Post by Norcal_Cichlid » Wed Sep 22, 2010 6:11 pm

Thanks again for all the info Dan. It's just maddening as you can tell how close they are again and again. Breeding colors are on almost constantly.
Current stock-2 F1 Breeding pairs of Chuco Micropthalmus, F1 Theraps Lentiginosum (2 breeding pairs), Theraps Coeruleus (1 breeding pair), 7 5-8" F0 Ornatum "Rio Choco", 2 Beani "White" and about 400 Micropthalmus fry!

Dan Woodland
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Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2006 9:49 am

Re: T. Asfraci breeding help

Post by Dan Woodland » Wed Sep 22, 2010 9:22 pm

Try not feeding them for a few days, do a large water change then feed them a nice meal.

Norcal_Cichlid
Posts: 278
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Re: T. Asfraci breeding help

Post by Norcal_Cichlid » Thu Sep 23, 2010 9:33 am

I'll try that out. I've started giving them raw shrimp once or twice a week around water change time and they go nuts for it. Bulking them up. Is you pair big?
Current stock-2 F1 Breeding pairs of Chuco Micropthalmus, F1 Theraps Lentiginosum (2 breeding pairs), Theraps Coeruleus (1 breeding pair), 7 5-8" F0 Ornatum "Rio Choco", 2 Beani "White" and about 400 Micropthalmus fry!

Dan Woodland
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Posts: 3048
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2006 9:49 am

Re: T. Asfraci breeding help

Post by Dan Woodland » Thu Sep 23, 2010 2:18 pm

Norcal_Cichlid wrote:I'll try that out. I've started giving them raw shrimp once or twice a week around water change time and they go nuts for it. Bulking them up. Is you pair big?
I don't have them any longer but my male was all of 12 inches. The female was wild and smaller at 6-8 inches, I was able to get her back from Panama.

paudavid
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Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2010 2:05 am

Re: T. Asfraci breeding help

Post by paudavid » Fri Sep 24, 2010 2:10 am

I had the same problem about a year ago.
What i simply did was reduce or eliminate their feeding day, and then waited a little bit and gave them a good meal.
Tha should help a lot, or atleast somwhat.

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