surrogate mother

Discussion about cichlids from Central America
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yellow 25
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surrogate mother

Post by yellow 25 » Fri Aug 17, 2007 7:43 am

i recently bred my jaguars and decided soon after to get rid of the female.they had literally only bred the night before i gave her away and was fanning about 1000 eggs at the time.i had a female festae in the tank seperated by a divider.this female is forever laying eggs and i knew she was keen to raise fry so i took the jaguar females eggs and put them in with the female festae.she took to them straight away and has adopted her breeding colouration and hatched them this afternoon.she has currently moved them and is guarding them as if they were her own.i was just curious to see if anyone has seen this kind of behaviour before.

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Juan Artigas
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Re: surrogate mother

Post by Juan Artigas » Fri Aug 17, 2007 6:49 pm

I never heard about this but it is quite an interesting observation in my opinion, please keep us posted about future developments
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Mr.Firemouth
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Re: surrogate mother

Post by Mr.Firemouth » Sat Aug 18, 2007 7:19 am

Mouth brooding africans are used as surrogates by a catfish called Symodontis Multipuntatus. This catfish will eat the cichlid eggs and lay it's own there. The cichlid will pick them up unknowingly and raise the catfish fry. This happens both in captivity and the wild.

It is very possible then for a CA cichlid to do the same. Parental instinct.
http://www.planetcatfish.com/cotm/cotm. ... cle_id=124
Thanks, Rich
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Juan Artigas
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Re: surrogate mother

Post by Juan Artigas » Sat Aug 18, 2007 8:00 am

Yes thanks I forgot the case, I was probably thinking on substrate spawners. Would anybody know of a similar case?
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Bas Pels
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Re: surrogate mother

Post by Bas Pels » Sat Aug 18, 2007 9:03 am

Yesterday, I intended to give a pair of Australoheros facetum to a friend.

They are with 12 in a 110 * 90 cm pond, thus with too much fishes. As I can not distinguish male from female - and certainly not from above - the best idea was to take a pair from their eggs.

So I did (they were very easily cought, they swam into the net themselves, to protect the eggs), and put them into a bucket.

We went in, looking at other fishes, and when we came back, the bucket was empty, but the fish were still alife. In order to try to maximize their chances of survival , we decided to put them back - into the same pond. Looking into that pond, we saw another pair protecting the eggs

A facetum is not central American, but more closely related to Central American cichlids than to a discus, for instance.

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Lisachromis
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Re: surrogate mother

Post by Lisachromis » Sat Aug 18, 2007 9:02 pm

Mr.Firemouth wrote:Mouth brooding africans are used as surrogates by a catfish called Symodontis Multipuntatus. This catfish will eat the cichlid eggs and lay it's own there. The cichlid will pick them up unknowingly and raise the catfish fry. This happens both in captivity and the wild.

It is very possible then for a CA cichlid to do the same. Parental instinct.
http://www.planetcatfish.com/cotm/cotm. ... cle_id=124
Just a slight correction.....

Spelling is Synodontis multipunctatus(cuckoo catfish). The catfish eats only a few of the eggs during their spawning dash into where the cichlids are spawning. If they ate them all, there would be no food for the developing catfish to survive; though if there is not enough, they'll try to eat each other.

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Mr.Firemouth
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Re: surrogate mother

Post by Mr.Firemouth » Sun Aug 19, 2007 3:30 pm

LOL, Lisa. Spell checker doesn't work on latin names ;)
Your right about the cats only eating some eggs. What a crazy way to survive. Evolution is nuts!
Thanks, Rich
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yellow 25
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Re: surrogate mother

Post by yellow 25 » Mon Aug 20, 2007 7:31 am

theyre free swimming now.something that was also interesting was that when i split them up i left half with the male jaguar and gave the rest to the female festae.the male jaguar picked up all of the fry that i left with him and ferried them over to the female festae.theyre seperated by eggcrate he spat them through this and has gone his seperate way

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EC
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Re: surrogate mother

Post by EC » Mon Aug 20, 2007 10:17 am

yellow 25 wrote:i was just curious to see if anyone has seen this kind of behaviour before.
It's normal behaviour in cichlids. Females (or pair) don't recognize fry and can defend all species of cichlids fry. Usually maternal mouthbrooders leave fry near pair of substrate depositors and they protect them with their own fry. One time I've put N. callipterus eggs (very different from mouthbrooder eggs) like live food in a mix tank and a leptosoma female began to incubate and keep in mouth for many days before I force to split it.

Ciao Enrico

MacFish
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Re: surrogate mother

Post by MacFish » Mon Aug 20, 2007 10:27 am

I had this with 2 males. I had a spawn of Thorichthys Maculipinnis once that half the fry were adopted by a male Honduran Red Point when they squeezed behind the divider. The male T. Mac got very nasty with the female so I removed her and left the fry to be raised by the 2 dads.

yellow 25
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Re: surrogate mother

Post by yellow 25 » Sat Sep 01, 2007 4:30 pm

shes still raising them heres some pics of her
Image
Image
Image
Image

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bennymoreno51
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Re: RE: Re: Identification Pelvicachroma pulcher male?

Post by bennymoreno51 » Wed May 06, 2015 12:58 pm

bennymoreno51 wrote:That is a great fish I some before mind frye
yellow 25 wrote:i recently bred my jaguars and decided soon after to get rid of the female.they had literally only bred the night before i gave her away and was fanning about 1000 eggs at the time.i had a female festae in the tank seperated by a divider.this female is forever laying eggs and i knew she was keen to raise fry so i took the jaguar females eggs and put them in with the female festae.she took to them straight away and has adopted her breeding colouration and hatched them this afternoon.she has currently moved them and is guarding them as if they were her own.i was just curious to see if anyone has seen this kind of behaviour before.
Lisachromis wrote:
Mr.Firemouth wrote:Mouth brooding africans are used as surrogates by a catfish called Symodontis Multipuntatus. This catfish will eat the cichlid eggs and lay it's own there. The cichlid will pick them up unknowingly and raise the catfish fry. This happens both in captivity and the wild.

It is very possible then for a CA cichlid to do the same. Parental instinct.
http://www.planetcatfish.com/cotm/cotm. ... cle_id=124
Just a slight correction.....

Spelling is Synodontis multipunctatus(cuckoo catfish). The catfish eats only a few of the eggs during their spawning dash into where the cichlids are spawning. If they ate them all, there would be no food for the developing catfish to survive; though if there is not enough, they'll try to eat each other.

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bennymoreno51
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Re: surrogate mother

Post by bennymoreno51 » Wed May 06, 2015 1:30 pm

Wow great stuff I seem where the catfish and a cichlid did cool video there that is the olny cichlid that dose that I do not know about catfish

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