ID on a unknown astatheros/amphilophus species

Discussion about cichlids from Central America
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davidefc
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ID on a unknown astatheros/amphilophus species

Post by davidefc » Tue Aug 14, 2012 8:40 am

I recently picked up a group of 9 of these unknown fish, I know who they came from, but I cannot get in contact with them.

Here is the largest of the fish, I am thinking calobrensis?

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Dave

Bas Pels
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Re: ID on a unknown astatheros/amphilophus species

Post by Bas Pels » Tue Aug 14, 2012 9:01 am

I'm quite certain you have 'Cichlasoma' calobrensae, a species which used to be grouped in the longimanus group, but recently has been remouved from this group

This is a rather sensitive species from Panama. Very beautiful indeed, but hard to keep. Clean water is very important. Thet are not rheophilic, but I think one best treats them as Theraps, but eventually the flow my be less. Males develop a lot of res pectacles on their head, females have them in a lesser degree. Assuming your fish is around 7 cm bodylength, I would assume it as a female. @ that size males ususally have more red - but yours can be a new, unkept variety

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davidefc
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Re: ID on a unknown astatheros/amphilophus species

Post by davidefc » Tue Aug 14, 2012 8:00 pm

Bas Pels wrote:I'm quite certain you have 'Cichlasoma' calobrensae, a species which used to be grouped in the longimanus group, but recently has been remouved from this group

This is a rather sensitive species from Panama. Very beautiful indeed, but hard to keep. Clean water is very important. Thet are not rheophilic, but I think one best treats them as Theraps, but eventually the flow my be less. Males develop a lot of res pectacles on their head, females have them in a lesser degree. Assuming your fish is around 7 cm bodylength, I would assume it as a female. @ that size males ususally have more red - but yours can be a new, unkept variety
Thanks, my prediction seems correct, I spoke to Rusty Wessel, he agrees calobrensae.

CRC has calobrensae under Amphilophus at the moment?

I take it you have kept this species before Bas Pels? Any tips, at the moment they are with around 30 juvenile Thorichthys sp.mixteco gold and a few Xiph.guentheri, they will be moved to a larger tank soon. A few pictures i have seen the female has a dorsal blotch - http://tangledupincichlids.com/images/calofem.jpg

I am glad I picked them up, they look like they can grow into a beautiful fish! Hopefully they will pick up some growth as they haven't grown much in a few months in the shop.

Dave

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Re: ID on a unknown astatheros/amphilophus species

Post by Bas Pels » Wed Aug 15, 2012 1:54 am

Indeed, Dave, I even bred them.

My experiences are given above: They are very sensitive towards bad water and bacteria. I have tried them a few times, each time without succes. Then it worked, in a tank with very littel fish, and when they got too big, I was able to put them in a new tank, that is, a tank which has not been used before, bringing their Eheim with them (as this had bacteria they were used to) as additional filter, to start the bacteria in the new filter.

This did work out nicely, and around 20 cm for the male they bred. However, later they died anyway.

Therefore my suggestion to treat them as fish from fast moving water: don't let the water spoil, don't feed too much proteins, do feed enough veggie matter - or good prepared food.

Wood is very nice in a tank, but it will - eventually - decay, enhancing the organic matter in the water, resuling in more bacteria in this water. Recently I started a tank for Theraps lentiginosum, and realizing this, I decided to do without wood. I can only say the Teraps did wonderfully, and I would suggest to keep calobrensae in a tank with little wood.

@ Astatheros / Amphilophus / 'Cichlasoma' - we will need a final describtion desperately, but this might take some time. I can only say that calobrensae did not pop out of DNA searches where one would expect them - thus 'Cichlasoma'

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davidefc
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Re: ID on a unknown astatheros/amphilophus species

Post by davidefc » Wed Aug 15, 2012 8:44 pm

Bas Pels wrote:Indeed, Dave, I even bred them.

My experiences are given above: They are very sensitive towards bad water and bacteria. I have tried them a few times, each time without succes. Then it worked, in a tank with very littel fish, and when they got too big, I was able to put them in a new tank, that is, a tank which has not been used before, bringing their Eheim with them (as this had bacteria they were used to) as additional filter, to start the bacteria in the new filter.

This did work out nicely, and around 20 cm for the male they bred. However, later they died anyway.

Therefore my suggestion to treat them as fish from fast moving water: don't let the water spoil, don't feed too much proteins, do feed enough veggie matter - or good prepared food.

Wood is very nice in a tank, but it will - eventually - decay, enhancing the organic matter in the water, resuling in more bacteria in this water. Recently I started a tank for Theraps lentiginosum, and realizing this, I decided to do without wood. I can only say the Teraps did wonderfully, and I would suggest to keep calobrensae in a tank with little wood.

@ Astatheros / Amphilophus / 'Cichlasoma' - we will need a final describtion desperately, but this might take some time. I can only say that calobrensae did not pop out of DNA searches where one would expect them - thus 'Cichlasoma'
Thanks for your response, can I ask what did you loose them to? I am a little worried, as they are in the tank with the T.mixteco golds but these fish are fish I have raised and for sale, so acouple times a week I stress them out netting mixteco golds out, I will give them their own tank asap, I could add them to my WC Rocio ocofasciata 'Cenote escondido' tank, there is plenty of space, what species did you keep them with.

I have never kept any Theraps as of yet, there isn't masses of wood in any of my tanks to be honest so it shouldn't be a problem.

Any pictures of your fish when you kept them?

Dave

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Re: ID on a unknown astatheros/amphilophus species

Post by gnuisance » Thu Aug 16, 2012 2:19 pm

interesting thread. Keep us posted on the Calos

Bas Pels
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Re: ID on a unknown astatheros/amphilophus species

Post by Bas Pels » Fri Aug 17, 2012 1:49 am

@ Dave

I have 11 pictures of them in my archive, taken in 2006. Only 1 is remotely acceptable, and I will try to upload it

It is completely impossible to retrieve what I kept them with in 2005/6, but it was with other species from Panama, and not with agressive ones. I ckept them with Cryptoheros panamensae, I've had A rhytisma - but I can not say in what tank they were (I had some 30 tanks in those days, currently 39)
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Marko Lenac
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Re: ID on a unknown astatheros/amphilophus species

Post by Marko Lenac » Fri Aug 17, 2012 2:02 am

wounds on the body is what mine had couple of times. crazy fishes. the males are one of the top 5 great looking cichlids I ever kept.
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smitty
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Re: ID on a unknown astatheros/amphilophus species

Post by smitty » Sat Aug 18, 2012 12:12 am

They are not an everyday pick up so pay extra attention to them. High aereated water is a must. But as long as you have very good water movement they will shine.
150gal- Dovi's; 3 AC 110 P.Filters; 2 AC 110 P.Heads; Eheim 2217,2260
180gal- Managuense; 3 AC 110 P.Filters; 2 AC 110 P.Heads; Eheim 2217,2260; FX5
210gal- Argta,Bifsct,Fnstrtus,Maculcda,Regani,Syns,Zntus; 4 AC P.Filters; 2 AC P.Hds; Eheim 2250,2262; FX5

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