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Laetacara dorsigera

Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 11:34 pm
by pk333
Hi guys,

I have been following Evans' thread, Laetacara identification - Updated with Pics, with interest. A recent post from Paulo José Alves in regards to the colouration of dorsigera collected from different countries intersted me. I know they are found in two seperate river systems, The Rio Parana & Rio Paraguay drainages through Southern Brazil, Argentina & Paraguay, and in the Rio Guaporé and Río Mamoré drainagees in Western Brazil & Bolivia.

I find it very intesting that this species is found in two very different water systems, far apart. My understanding is that populations from different areas have different colouration.

I bought a juvenile pair at the begining of July, and they spawned two days later. OK here's my long shot question, is it possible for anyone to tell from pictures of my pair where they are from?

The female
Image

The male
Image

Thier first spawn
Image

Guarding fry
Image


Like I said this is a long shot question and I don't hold much hope of finding out.




That's what the importer said they were.

Re: Laetacara dorsigera

Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 5:19 am
by Paulo José Alves
Hi

I didn´t receive the L dorsigerus from Bolivia so I can´t tell you if your fish are at least from there or not. But not knowing the origin of your fish I do nonetheless recognize the strain, it´s one that the red ocupies a little more than half the ventral area when breeding and that has some purplish red when not breeding in the anterior part of the chest. A person I know has this strain and in November he might receive some fish of Argentinian origin. The fish from this last origin are already of a subtropical area which means that they endure well low temperatures. Recently Apistogramma borelli were discovered in Uruguay which makes me suspect that L. dorsigerus also exists there, the distribution of both species is pratically the same everywhere.

Re: Laetacara dorsigera

Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 6:12 am
by pk333
G'day Paulo José Alves,

My dorsigera don't show any red at all, whether in breeding dress or not. A most, there is a little purplish hue on the chest area when breeding.

Re: Laetacara dorsigera

Posted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 5:40 am
by Paulo José Alves
G´day

OK, but your fish is the same that a friend of mine has. Origin unknown.

Re: Laetacara dorsigera

Posted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 12:41 pm
by Darrell Ullisch
Well, this won't help figure out where your fish came from, but I thought it might add some incentive for someone to go looking. In 1972, my friend Randy Barfell spawned a fish that we were told was "curviceps" by the experts of the day. I was in the Navy at the time, and by the time I got out in '75, there were no more of these around. I've been looking for this population of dorsigera ever since, as it is the only one that is cherry red, rather than the dark wine red/purple color of the strains I've seen lately. I bred a wine red population in '79, without the black of pk333's strain. By 1983 I was aware of the differences between curviceps and dorsigera, and bred the real curviceps, which turned almost completely black during breeding.

This picture, taken by Randy Barfell, is the strain of dorsigera from 1972; you can see why I wanted it back so badly.
dorsigera 72.JPG
I've also bred "Buckelkopf", had flavilabris (which were sold to me as thayeri) lay eggs once, and seen the real thayeri spawning in a friend's tank in Milwaukee. The one I haven't seen, and would love to get, is the "Orangeflossen", fulvipinnis.

Re: Laetacara dorsigera

Posted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 3:10 pm
by Lisachromis
That's a fantastic looking Laetacara.

Too many fish, too little time....

Re: Laetacara dorsigera

Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2008 10:04 pm
by pk333
G'day Darrell Ullisch,

Awesome dorsigera.

I spent a couple of years looking for dorsigera with no success here. I don't know if your aware, but Australia has some pretty restrictive import laws when it comes to the ornamental fish trade. Basically no one would import them becuase there was no demand for them, even though they are on our Allowable Import List

Then out of the blue a small shipment came in, and was split between 3 LFS here. Out of about 30 fish, I was only able to identify 2 females, and they were at different LFS. The fish were all young adults, and the two females paired up in the LFS tanks. My regular LFS held it's pair for me untill I could set up a new tank, the other LFS moved it's pair to it's planted SA display tank. I bought the first pair from my regular LFS, and then headed over to the other LFS, but unfortunately some one had bought it's pair the day before.

I also have a pair of curviceps. Almost all our curviceps come from Asian farms and are pretty washed out. I bought my pair from the LFS owned by the president of our Cichlid Club. They were bred locally, and are supposed to have come from wild caught stock.

My curvieps turn Blue during breeding. Here are a couple of photos. My photographic skills are pretty bad, and it's a rarity if I manage to get an in-focus shot.

My pair. Photo taken when I was cleaning the tank.
Image

Male guarding eggs
Image

Female patrolling the area
Image

The eggs hatched the next day and the pair moved the wigglers into a flower pot.
Image

My female goes into Super Blue stay away mode.
Image

Well, this won't help figure out where your fish came from, but I thought it might add some incentive for someone to go looking. In 1972, my friend Randy Barfell spawned a fish that we were told was "curviceps" by the experts of the day. I was in the Navy at the time, and by the time I got out in '75, there were no more of these around. I've been looking for this population of dorsigera ever since, as it is the only one that is cherry red, rather than the dark wine red/purple color of the strains I've seen lately. I bred a wine red population in '79, without the black of pk333's strain. By 1983 I was aware of the differences between curviceps and dorsigera, and bred the real curviceps, which turned almost completely black during breeding.

This picture, taken by Randy Barfell, is the strain of dorsigera from 1972; you can see why I wanted it back so badly.
dorsigera 72.JPG
I've also bred "Buckelkopf", had flavilabris (which were sold to me as thayeri) lay eggs once, and seen the real thayeri spawning in a friend's tank in Milwaukee. The one I haven't seen, and would love to get, is the "Orangeflossen", fulvipinnis.[/quote]

Re: Laetacara dorsigera

Posted: Sun Nov 30, 2008 9:01 am
by krebszurich
Hi,

This picture can help you to identify your L. dorsigera.

Here it s for sure a wild caught L. Dorsigera from Bolivia. Santa Cruz dept.

Re: Laetacara dorsigera

Posted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 3:05 am
by Bojan Dolenc
Paulo José Alves wrote:... Recently Apistogramma borelli were discovered in Uruguay which makes me suspect that L. dorsigerus also exists there, the distribution of both species is pratically the same everywhere.
The present study records for the first time the small cichlidae fish Laetacara dorsigera (Heckel, 1840) at Uruguay River basin and state of Rio Grande do Sul, southern Brazil, previously known from Amazon, Paraná and Paraguay River basins. Although the ichthyofauna of Uruguay River basin is relatively well known, this record suggests that there are still unexplored environments, such as wetlands, where there may be species not yet reported, and found in other hydrographic systems.
Reference: Lanés, Luis Esteban Krause & Leonardo Maltchik & Carlos Alberto S. de Lucena, 2010, Pisces, Perciformes, Cichlidae, Laetacara dorsigera (Heckel, 1840): Distribution extension and first record for Uruguay River basin, and state of Rio Grande do Sul, southern Brazil, Check LIst, Journal of species lists and distribution, ISSN 1809-127X (online edition), v. 6 | Issue 1 | pp.116-118.
http://www.checklist.org.br/getpdf?NGD002-10

Re: Laetacara dorsigera

Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 5:44 am
by Paulo José Alves
Hi

Thanks Bojan. Probably Uruguay is next. As far as I know this species goes quite far north in the Mato Grosso do Norte state in Brasil but id doesn´t exist in any Amazon tributary.

All The Best
Paulo José