Mystery Fish

Discussion about cichlids from Africa other than Rift Lake
Dave Schumacher
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Mystery Fish

Post by Dave Schumacher » Tue Mar 08, 2005 6:41 am

I'm not sure what category these fish fall under since I am not sure what they are! Does anyone recognize them? I have a colony of 7, as does my friend Greg Steeves. The pictures were taken by Greg. They were purchased as Haplochromis sp. Polli Yellow, and I am uncertain if they are a Victorian Basin cichlid, or perhaps a West African of some type. The only "Hap." polli I know of is Ctenochromis polli, and they are certainly not that!

Thanks!!!

Image
Male and Female

Image
Male
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Randall
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Haplochromine sp.

Post by Randall » Thu Mar 10, 2005 3:36 pm

Hello Dave,

At first glance, I thought you might have a Pseudocrenilabrus sp., then I noticed the egg spots on the male's anal fin. Pseudocrenilabrus males don't exhibit them. I have no idea how you might have come across such a fish, but they remind me of a Thoracochromis sp., perhaps T. buysi. Perhaps others here will respond as well.

Gorgeous fish! Do well with them, and please send some fry my way!

All the best,

Randall Kohn
Have you fed your fish a shrimp today?

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Post by Dave Schumacher » Thu Mar 10, 2005 7:34 pm

They are VERY productive!!! I also thought they looked like a Thoracochromis sp. T. buysi has a longer snout though, don't they? Greg believes they are T. demeusii, but I have never heard reports of a demeusii exhibiting any color.

Randall: Do you plan on going to the ACA this summer? If so, I can bring some to you there.
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Thoracochomis sp.

Post by Randall » Thu Mar 10, 2005 9:58 pm

Hello Dave,

Yes, I will be in Fort Worth come July and would love some of your fry. If it's okay with you, I would like to forward your pics to some ichthyologists for identification.

Thanks much!

All the best,

Randall Kohn
Have you fed your fish a shrimp today?

Dave Schumacher
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Post by Dave Schumacher » Fri Mar 11, 2005 8:16 am

Please do! I've sent them to Anton Lamboj and Yves Fermon so far. I am shipping some to them as well!
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Post by Paulo José Alves » Tue Jun 07, 2005 6:07 am

Hi

Isn´t this Orthochromis machadoi from the Cunene River in the Angola/Namibia border? It sure looks like it.
All The Best
Paulo José

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Post by Philippe Burnel » Tue Jun 07, 2005 11:21 am


Paulo José Alves
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Post by Paulo José Alves » Thu Jun 09, 2005 6:08 am

Dear Phillipe Burnel

I saw the site indicated by you and first, the picture is quite bad and not very helpfull. Second, there it says that O. machadoi comes from Zaire. Doesn´t it come from Angola/Namibia?
All The Best
Paulo José

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Post by Philippe Burnel » Thu Jun 09, 2005 12:53 pm

Yes, that's a mistake !
anyway the fish above is not an Orthochromis sp.
The proposition for T. buysi is possible (I don't know this species.)
But the 1rst idea I had when I saw the first pics was hybrid of Astatotilapia calliptera and ???

Correction ! I just have a look to Lamboj's book and I must agree that the fish seems very closed to the machadoi in the book !

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Post by tjudy » Thu Jun 09, 2005 5:28 pm

I agree that it looks similar to machodai, but I am leaning towrds an Astatotilapia sp. I saw some A. callipterus recently in Colorado Springs that are very very similar to the fish in the pictures.

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Post by Dave Schumacher » Fri Jun 10, 2005 7:40 am

I think I've actually figured out what it is. Here is a link to my local club's (Hill Country Cichlid Club) latest newsletter. In it, you will find an article written by Greg Steeves about a Haplochromis sp. Flavenentis. At the end of the article, there are two pictures. One was taken by Greg of some that I had given to him, the other is a pic that Heiko Bleher took of a fish he called Haplochromis sp. 46. If you look at the pattern in the dorsal fin and the overall shape of the body, the fish are identical. There are some differences in coloration of the fish, but I believe that it is due to camera flash. Please let me know what you think.

http://www.xdeleon.com/hccc/newsletter/LL-June-2005.pdf
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Post by Florent » Sat Jun 11, 2005 2:36 am

Paulo José Alves wrote:Dear Phillipe Burnel

I saw the site indicated by you and first, the picture is quite bad and not very helpfull. Second, there it says that O. machadoi comes from Zaire. Doesn´t it come from Angola/Namibia?
the fish on the link may be an Orthochromis stormsi but not a machadoi.

I think Greg and ds1196 fishes aren't Orthochromis because males don't have such ocelli in anal fin.

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Post by Paulo José Alves » Sat Jun 11, 2005 4:40 am

Hi


I´ve just seen the German Cichlid Association magazine and there you find an Orthocromis machadoi photo. It sure has a similarity with the photos that were shown here, however they are not decisive and unfortunatelly the coloration pattern of the tail is not shown. There is also a T. buysi photo, a completely diferent fish.
All The Best
Paulo José

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Post by Mark Smith » Thu May 04, 2006 5:03 pm

This fish is clearly not a species of Thoracochromis or Orthochromis. I don't mean to be skeptical for "skepticalness" sake, but the Heiko photo of H. 46 doesn't appear to be this species either. This beautiful yellow cichlid certainly looks like it has been in captivity for some time, as it has that "look" of an inbred captive fish. It is possible that it is a hybrid, but hard to be completely sure on that possibility. The problem with fish that suddenly pop up in the hobby, seemingly out of nowhere, is that often there is no exact collecting locality data attached to it. Hybrids and or selective strains of cichlids have come onto the market place for decades now, and those responsible often try to hide their handywork from the hobby at large.

Just my two cents,

Mark

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Post by Mark Smith » Thu May 04, 2006 10:18 pm

Please beg my pardon everyone

Only after I posted my initial opinion, did I realize that this was an old post from last year.

Just out of curiosity, has anyone been able to trace the origins of this cichlid yet??

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Astatotilapia calliptera

Post by Randall » Thu May 04, 2006 10:28 pm

Hello friends,

Yes, last year I traced the origins of this fish and know when, where, and by whom it was collected. When I have a definitive indentification, I will post it here.

Thanks!

Randall Kohn

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Post by Mark Smith » Thu May 04, 2006 11:16 pm

Thanks Randall!

I look forward to that info. As our beloved hobby has become a more detail oriented, precise information on new species coming into the trade should have solid collecting info backing it up whenever possible.

Take care,
Mark

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Post by Dave Schumacher » Fri May 05, 2006 7:29 am

Wow, Randall! I had given up trying. I'm very curious, so please post as soon as possible!

Thanks!!!
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Astatotilapia calliptera?

Post by Randall » Sun May 07, 2006 10:43 am

Hello Friends,

I'm afraid the mystery haplochromine remains a mystery. Ds1196 kindly forwared a batch of fry to me last year, and I, in turn, presented them to Anton Lamboj who was speaking at the 2005 Northeast Council convention. Although the information I have all points to Astatotilapia calliptera, Dr. Lamboj thinks otherwise, but is not able to make a definitive indentification. Hence the mystery haplochromine remains a mystery.

Thanks!

All the best,

Randall Kohn

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Post by Mark Smith » Mon May 08, 2006 8:53 pm

Hi Randall

This yellow mystery cichlid is definitely not A. calliptera. Just check out Koning's excellent photos of A. calliptera, taken in situ, in his books.

I am really thinking that this yellow cichlid is a hybrid. The barring on the photo of the female looks very remeniscient of the barring seen on Aulonocara baenschi or A. sp. Maleri. It stubby, compact body doesn't sit right with me either. I think everyone should very cautious about this fish until a positve collecting locality is known and photos of freshly caught specimens can be seen.

Mark

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